SparkFun Electronics Commentsurn:uuid:214d0e4e-f1b1-d287-ce26-ac5b4c9f82492024-03-29T00:55:11-06:00SparkFun ElectronicsBradLevy on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksBradLevyurn:uuid:23691d66-acf9-0913-5c02-c73df1ca7ed72013-12-26T11:44:47-07:00<p>And another Schematic/PCB editor to consider is DesignSpark PCB. It isn't open source, but it is free, without limits on board size or commercial use.<p>I've also used a higher-end commercial package at a past employer, and free ExpressPCB in the past for prototypes.</p><p>ExpressPCB is easy to use, but while it is free, it doesn't output gerbers, so you are limited in who you could use for the fabrication unless you "buy" gerbers for your design from ExpressPCB. It is also more limited in other respects.</p><p>I've found DesignSpark PCB to be roughly comparable to the commercial package I had used. It has its share of annoyances, but some really nice features, too. The biggest hindrance for a beginner is the schematic library symbols for many common parts tend to be rectangles, with properly numbered pins, but not the more common functional symbols like triangle for op amp, etc. You can add your own symbols to the library, though, and easily associate them with the components. (I plan to share a library of such symbols I've created, in order to make it easier for (I think) the majority of us who prefer the functional symbols.) The other downside is that its only native version is for Windows.
The other up-side, though, is that it has footprints for a very large library of parts, and in many cases has multiple footprints available for the same package, following IPC standards for dense, normal, and loose (hand-solder) designs.</p></p>
Sleepwalker3 on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksSleepwalker3urn:uuid:30f083db-48a8-0a1f-bff3-8f82fd08b9a72013-12-22T06:52:19-07:00<p>What then would you recommend? I like Altium and it seems to flow reasonably well, though some things (can't think of specific examples just at the moment), don't seem to have kept pace with the general software world. I've tried Eagle and it just seems so darn foreign compared with other tools I've used.</p>
BiOzZ420 on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksBiOzZ420urn:uuid:666d2d38-80bf-23e9-b5ad-e0aead1704402013-12-20T11:40:19-07:00<p>because eagle has been for many many years the professionals choice when they dont want to spend any money
there not going to up and change just because some other tool may or may not be better at the time
but i have to disagree about KiCAD i find it to be overly simplified where it should not be and overly complicated where it should be easy and it crashes too much
im also not an altium fan, i have to use it for work and it was back in the day the best tool you can use but they have lagged behind other free suits</p>
J.R. on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksJ.R.urn:uuid:7514b6bd-fcd2-d970-440d-8a6feb3dfdee2013-12-20T09:06:26-07:00<p>I have to +1 this. I started with Eagle because that is what SF promotes (and provides tutorials for!). I really appreciate the support they provided when I was starting out, but now that I use KiCad (Had to switch for commercial application) I wish I had started there. No restrictions on boards, open source, and has the option to use a single schematic with multiple board layouts (big seller for me). So you can design an Arduino clone in a schematic, and then choose to make both a SMD and Through Hole version just by selecting different footprints! I used this recently with a power board I designed, started with TO-220 transistors and switched to SMD D2Pak with the same initial schematic.</p>
Kamiquasi on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksKamiquasiurn:uuid:4a6b0de2-2479-9199-09d5-b9bef193d28d2013-12-20T08:17:27-07:00<p>Not to worry - others have wagged that tongue before :)<p>While I agree that it would be nice (and that's an understatement) for SparkFun to support open source solutions even further, I don't think that <em>dropping</em> support for Eagle would be a smart move. If nothing else, you can easily go from Eagle to KiCAD, the other way around is not as easily done (and to the end-user, it really doesn't matter who is to blame for that).<br>
KiCAD is making great strides and I'm sure SFE's engineers continually review what the best product is - not only for everyday work, but also for making material available publicly. Think evolution, rather than revolution.</p><p>In the mean time, it helps more to promote KiCAD than it does to criticize Eagle ( and really, we've already had a browser war thread in the comments recently, I don't think a repeat in the domain of EDAs would be fun ;) )<br>
For example, what ways can you think of in KiCAD to accomplish the basic premise of this article; How do you get a component from an existing schematic/board into a library?</p></p>
SynapseRapture on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksSynapseRaptureurn:uuid:4d06e44a-7eb5-fd2f-3769-c28fd8b9226e2013-12-20T07:54:04-07:00<p>Absolutely. I definitely don't want to discredit having a thorough understanding of the schema, or XML in general. Pairing those abilities, like you said, reduces the hair-pulling moments substantially: knowing both would almost certainly bump up productivity.</p>
Customer #415734 on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksCustomer #415734urn:uuid:9e5b70f3-ee18-0111-685b-a37cf1a314f62013-12-20T05:46:34-07:00<p>Alright, I've held my tongue long enough.<p>What is it with SparkFun and Eagle? I really feel that SparkFun needs to drop its Eagle 'support' and start supporting KiCAD. As a site that prides itself on open source materials, I could never understand why everything is designed using freemium software when there is a better, as easy to use, open source alternative. On the surface, KiCAD is as easy to use as Eagle. However you can dive into the deep end and get functionality that almost rivals that of something like Altium Designer. Learning Eagle is a dead end. The work flow that Eagle implements doesn't translate well to other EDAs and you're severely limited with the free version of Eagle.</p><p>SparkFun's New Years resolution should be to kick Eagle to the curb...</p></p>
Byron J. on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksByron J.urn:uuid:16521b47-8ed5-b12e-beef-9b7ecac05b9a2013-12-19T14:44:28-07:00<p>I just gave that a try, and it works. As with a lot of things (particularly in Eagle), there is often more than one solution to a problem.<p>It may not entirely avoid the need to merge with an external library (it looks like it only extracts the components used on the schem), but it certainly helps distill the tags needed by the library from the rest of the schem to make the merge easier.</p><p>Combine that with the newly found schema, and a decent validating XML editor, and it's a lot easier.</p></p>
Byron J. on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksByron J.urn:uuid:7889378f-d3ad-6e60-5b69-5b7b09529dc02013-12-19T14:24:55-07:00<blockquote>
<p>The XML schema included in every installation of EAGLE.</p>
<p>You're right - there it is!</p><p>I just plugged it into <a href="http://xml-copy-editor.sourceforge.net/" rel="nofollow">XML Copy Editor</a>, and it's able to validate files against the schema.</p><p>Thanks!</p></blockquote>
pt on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle Trickspturn:uuid:5363d64c-986d-0e51-16ff-b0e7872dc0b92013-12-19T12:41:02-07:00<p>hi Member #134773, on the product pages we link to gEDA, KiCAD (we say "If you're interested in open-source PCB design software check out gEDA and KiCAD") and we also say clearly you can download the software at any time "you can download the software at any time to try it out before purchasing a license". if there's better or different wording you think we should use let us know!</p>
Customer #500959 on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksCustomer #500959urn:uuid:89309ebf-87c3-975d-a54f-89b4db39e1a42013-12-19T10:01:24-07:00<p>The XML schema included in every installation of EAGLE. You can find it in the Doc folder of your installation, the file is called eagle.dtd.<p>As already mentioned you can extract all of the libraries from a board schematic pair by running the exp-lbrs.ulp that comes with EAGLE. In V6 you can run it directly by going File -> Export -> Libraries.</p><p>hth,</p><p>Jorge Garcia
Cadsoft Computer</p></p>
SynapseRapture on Enginursday - Stupid Eagle TricksSynapseRaptureurn:uuid:c7ee2f6d-7c90-f479-eed9-61056220e3112013-12-19T09:24:39-07:00<p>This is a great explanation of the inner-workings of Eagle lbrs! I've run into this very problem myself. It turns out, if you run a built-in ULP, you can extract all the components from your schematic or board directly into their original respective libraries (or merge them into one unified library).<p>That would be: <em>from your board or schematic view</em> <strong>File</strong> -> <strong>Run (ULP)</strong> -> <strong>Open exp-lbrs.ulp</strong> -> <strong>Select export path</strong> -> <strong>Select whether to merge libraries</strong> -> <strong>Hit OK</strong></p><p>Then, you can import the resultant libraries, pick them apart, reorganize them, etc. <em>Note: older versions of eagle may have "exp-project-lbr.ulp" instead.</em></p><p>I think it's important to understand the nuances of the xml involved in storing library data and the open possibilities for creating those custom scripts or programs to modify components. So Byron's tutorial is still a great resource, kudos!</p></p>